WILLIAM BLACK - 4 Steps to Becoming A Successful Artist

William Black has been tugging at the heart strings of fans from all over the world with his emotion-driven bass music and DJ sets. Collaborating with artists like Slander and Illenium, his songs have gotten tens of millions of plays on Spotify and he is regularly touring at some of the biggest clubs and festivals around the world.

In this episode we reverse engineer his success and uncover 4 steps that were integral in getting him to where he is today:

1. Cut The Bullshit 
2. Learn and Master Your Craft
3. Take The Leap
4. Be Grateful 

Follow William Black here:
https://www.instagram.com/williamblack
https://www.tiktok.com/discover/william-black

And visit my site to join the mailing list, book a free coaching call or get in touch:
https://www.nikcherwink.com

Transcript

Nik: 0:00

want write music that.

Track 1: 0:02

That can help people or that can evoke some emotion from people. just in the same way that my favorite songs do for me, because you know, after being sober for a little bit and the brain fog kind of lifting, I realized like, these songs that I really love, like, why do I love these songs? It's because they make me feel something. I want to be able to do that. I want to be able to make people feel something for music. So how can I, how can I do that with my music?

Nik: 0:41

What's up everybody? Welcome to the Headliner Mindset podcast. Today's guest has been taking fans from all over the world through a roller coaster of emotions with his music, collaborating with artists like Millennium and Slander. His tracks are getting tens of millions of plays on Spotify and being released on some of the biggest labels in dance music. This is William Black.

Track 1: 1:02

What's up guys? Happy to be here.

Nik: 1:04

Dude, happy to happen, man. it is really good to reconnect with you. You know, you are one of the guests that I have a long history with. Somebody that I knew from many years ago as a student Icon Collective, at this has happened a couple times where it's like. I had a relationship with somebody, this sort of like, you know, student teacher, mentor relationship. And then, you know, life goes on some years pass and then all of a sudden I, I open up Instagram one day and I'm like, oh, this guy's playing in front of 10,000 people I'm like, I'm like, What the fuck? Like, what

Track 1: 1:42

Yeah. what

Nik: 1:43

yeah. What happened? You know? So I'm really excited to reconnect and, and kind of fill in the gaps of what happened.'cause it's, it's been quite a while since I've seen you and you have achieved a lot of success since I've seen you. off, congratulations. And, um, yeah man, thank you for being here. Uh, you know what's crazy is I was talking to a friend, an Icon Collective. I was, when I, when I met you, it was 10 years ago, which makes me feel old.'cause I was like, I was like, I think I was 18 or 19. think I was 19. Like I might've been the youngest dude at Icon when I went you went like right outta high school. yeah, summer happened and then I, you know, I tried community college dropped out.

Track 1: 2:24

Went to Icon. Well, some other things happened in between, but yeah, pretty much right after high school and feel like, uh, it was great. You know, it was, it was a, it was a journey.

Nik: 2:35

does it feel like it's been a decade? Because to me, like it doesn't feel like it was that long ago, but 10 years is a whole decade.

Track 1: 2:43

a long time.

Nik: 2:43

That's a long time.

Track 1: 2:46

I mean, I feel like it does and it doesn't, you know, like actually, it's so funny, you know, I opened my old laptop, the one I got right before I went to Icon, it's from like 2012. I was like, let's see if it even turns on, you know?'cause I haven't used it and God knows how long. And I was looking at what I was doing and, you know, all this stuff. And I was like, okay, now it feels like it's been a long time. But when I, when I think about it, like, oh, that wasn't that long ago. It, I mean, I feel like we changed so much as people. It's, it's so interesting.

Nik: 3:17

Yeah, time flies when you're having fun, as they say.

Track 1: 3:21

It's true.

Nik: 3:22

I am very excited to hear about how you've changed over this last decade. And, I have an idea for how I want to structure this podcast, which this idea just hit me. I was taking, I, I was taking a walk earlier and, you know, oftentimes I'll sit down and kind of intellectually calculate like, where do I want to go with this podcast? Uh, what are some of the questions to ask this person? And rather than, than doing that in my typical way, this idea popped into my head because where I'm at right now, I've been going through a process of, you know, really trying to figure out My coaching and process like, Mm-Hmm. system what are the steps that I want to take people through? Because to be honest, it's of been all over the place. I've coached so many different people at different stages in their life and their career with different challenges and different problems. And you now I'm, I'm building out a course which is very exciting, like a, like a group coaching program where, you know, I'm gonna have a series of lessons and steps and pretty much all the business coaching ad advice is like, you know, have system, like a singular system that you kinda walk people through. And so I know everybody's path is different, everybody's journey is different, and no one path looks the same. No one system or, or process. There's no one size fits all. However, I thought it would be fun for us to. Really look at of William Black and kind of reverse engineer this last decade of, you know, being, uh, an up and coming artist and really look at like, what really was the process for you? And, and if we could kind of put like a framework to it, you know, like what would, if, if William Black was a coach, he's like, all right, is step one as an artist that wants to make it, you know, on this path? Like, what would step one be?

Track 1: 5:19

For me it was Okay, so if you're gonna follow my path, you have to become a drug addict and then get sober really, really young in life.

Nik: 5:28

Yeah.

Track 1: 5:29

don't do that. I'm just kidding. But that's what I did.

Nik: 5:32

yeah. that's the thing, man. Is there, there's a lot of other people that also are up in some shit that are like, Ugh, I have this dream. I want to be an artist. There's this thing me that's calling me. But are caught in, yeah. Drugs, alcohol, chasing girls like other, know, I don't know what it is everyone. A lot of people have their addictions and their vices, so. There's so many, it's, it's funny'cause I think about it a lot and. And, you know, so I mean, a little bit of what happened when I was in high school, I was, I was just doing a lot of drugs and it, it progressed and by the time, you know, I had graduated high school somehow, like I, I don't know how I graduated, but I did and I tried community college and I just, you know, that wasn't my focus.

Track 1: 6:19

My focus was getting high. So that's what I did. but it got so bad that I needed to seek outside help and, you know, my parents were begging me to go to rehab and I had a friend who's a year older than me that, that went to Icahn Collective. And so I knew that was in LA and that's what I wanted to do. I was like, this, this is what I need to do. And yeah, my parents were like, you know, you should go to rehab and, and get help and get better. And then, you know, that's that music school you wanted to go do is. Is in la so you should move to la I grew up in Orange County about an hour from LA and for whatever reason there was just like a split, split second of just like, maybe this is the right thing to do because, because you can really chase your dreams. And it's almost like my passion for music, took over my addiction for just like a split second. And I made the decision. I was like, okay, like I'm gonna get help. And, and it's so funny'cause I remember, you know, people tell all these like weird stories of different things that have happened to them, but I, I got changed one time from buying something on a dollar bill. It was a psychic's number. And so I called the psychic and, and they were like, she gave me this whole rundown that was like, how would you know all this stuff about me? And, and she was like, you know, you're really, really passionate about something. But there's something that you're doing that's holding you back from being successful.

Nik: 7:56

Hmm.

Track 1: 7:56

And at the time, I was 18 years old at the time, I'm like, oh, it's my parents. You know, they're not letting me do, but you know, I, I don't know, maybe five or 60 years after that happened, I, I remembered that and I was like, wow. It was, I was, it was me. I was holding myself back. It was the, it was the drugs. It was,

Nik: 8:16

Yeah. Those inner demons. Holding it, holding us back. Yeah. okay. So I think this is so important'cause this actually is kind of one of the lessons that I have in, in my process, which is clearing out bullshit we could call it. Right. Whatever, whatever that may be. Right. Whether it is an addiction, which is fucking easier said than done. And, and I really want to, you know, commend and congratulate you for, you know, that, and I know it's also process too. Right. so you said did, you went to rehab and then you you Yeah. I was actually still in rehab when I went to Icon. Wow. Um, yeah, so I, you know, it's another funny story is I, uh, I went and did the interview process at Icon and just talked about how passionate I was for music, and then they're like, okay, we'll let you know if you get in or not, you know, and in the meantime, I went and I got a job working at this, uh, native American themed store at. On the Venice boardwalk, it's like you walk past it and it's like, I would be like standing out there trying to sell people Native American themed T-shirts that are like tie dye. It was my first day. The guy was That's that's so Venice It so you know, typical, typical, I need money. I'm living in LA job.

Track 1: 9:38

and, you know, I couldn't, I, I turned my phone off for, to go into my first day of work at the, at the store. And when I got into my car, I had a message from Varun at the time and he said, Hey, congratulations, you know, you're accepted. And I was like, hell yeah. I'm never coming back to this job ever again. I ne I didn't even, I mean, it's not the best thing. I never even told the guy that I was, I wasn't coming back. I just ignored him. I was like, this is the

Nik: 10:07

ghosted.

Track 1: 10:08

I ghosted him. and so I feel like, um. Yeah. Whether it's, you know, whether it's an addiction or just, I think there's a lot of, I think a lot of people like to find, and this is speaking from personal experience too, find somebody to blame for something. It's like something's not going the way you want it to go in life. It couldn't be my fault. Like, I, I shouldn't look inward at this problem. I should find some reason to reason it's somebody else's fault. You know what I mean? Somebody else to blame or something. It's like, oh, well I can't, I can't become a DJ because I have to work full time or I can't be successful. It's like, I know that's bullshit because I worked full-time and then I also got off work and did music full-time and I had no, no life

Nik: 11:00

yeah.

Track 1: 11:01

'cause I wanted to be, I, I knew that to get to where I needed to be. I needed to like bust my ass hard.

Nik: 11:07

Mm mm-Hmm. Tell me a little bit about that. That drive, like you knew that was what you wanted.

Track 1: 11:16

it's so funny. I feel like I've, I've talked about this before and like even from the age of 16 when I first went to a rave and saw somebody making music and, making people feel with their music, just performing. I knew that's what I wanted to do and I knew that I was gonna be successful doing it. And not from just like a, a cocky way. It was just like, I had no doubt in my mind that I was gonna do it. And then fast forward five years, maybe, maybe even longer, maybe like seven, seven years. And I started, so some of these things started to happen for me and I. It wasn't until they became real that I started doubting myself more. It was like I had, I had all the, the, the confidence that it was gonna be successful. And then it was like, oh shit, things are happening. I'm getting booked for shows. People are starting to take notice. What if, what if I, it, it doesn't last. What if it fails? What if, what if this isn't it? And it was, it was weird that I didn't start doubting myself until I started becoming successful.

Nik: 12:28

Hmm. Why do you think that is?

Track 1: 12:30

I don't know. I, I think it was just like, it's so hard to look at your life as it's happening. Like, you know, I know that if I went back to 17, 18 years old and saw what I'm doing right now with music, I would be like, holy shit. I surpassed everything I could have imagined. And, and also, you know, your, your goals change. It goes from, I need to play main stage. I. At this festival, whatever, to, I want to play to a venue of this many people. That's my show or whatever. It changes, you know. But I, at the beginning of my career, I told myself, if I can get signed to X label, then I'll have made it. And then I did that and I was like, well, that didn't really do what I thought it was gonna do for me, so I need to find the next thing. And then we're always, as an artist, I'm always like battling, being grateful for what I have and, and what I've built and, and also not becoming stagnant and still trying to build more,

Nik: 13:41

Yeah.

Track 1: 13:42

which is really hard to do.

Nik: 13:44

The. unquenchable thirst of the ego, right? Which is also such, this is the paradox. It is such an important driving force for us. Our nature is to grow. We've been growing since we on this planet. We've been learning how to walk, how to talk. We've been physically growing. We've been hopefully, you know, emotionally, mentally growing as well. And so, there's a fundamental human need growth. That's where we get fulfillment. but it's also this tricky little thing of having true fulfillment gratitude along the way as well, right? Like, like wanting more, but also at the same time being really happy with what you have. It's so hard. It's, I, you know, I've ta I've talked to i, my therapist about it, and he was like, you know, you have, you have this like, drive in you that's constantly pushing you. And a lot of the time it's, it sometimes stems from, from like anxiety. It's like, well, if, what if, you know, what if this happens?

Track 1: 14:46

And what if that happens? And he's like, I. You know, you can look at it as a negative, and in, in some cases it might be, but like, that's how you are. And so like how, how does that anxiety or that, that like constant overthinking and drive in your career, like, how does that serve you? And I'm like, well, I never have, especially early in my career, nothing was ever good enough. So it was like I have to keep pushing, pushing and pushing. And, and if I got told no or this wasn't good enough, it's like, all right, how do I make it better? instead of being like, oh, well they just don't like it and I should give up, it was like, okay, well they're wrong and I need to prove them that, that I can be better or whatever it may be.

Nik: 15:30

yeah. This is. Something that I went through and circled around very with one of my clients that I'm just remembering now, where he had this deep drive inside of him, where, you know, it, it, it served him where it was basically coming from this place of, uh, like it's never enough. Like as long as it's never enough, gonna be driven to want more and get to the next level. But at the same time, he was always carrying with him just dissatisfaction and this unfulfillment, right? And so, but ultimately underneath it, it was a fear of like, it can't be enough. I can't allow it. I can't allow myself to be content and ultimately I can't allow myself to be happy because if I'm happy and I'm content, stop moving forward. I'll That was the, the, the deep unconscious belief that was in there. And so we really had to pick that apart and start looking at like, okay, well what else can it be about? Where else can this be coming from? You know? And I think that's the, that's the question. Like, you know, for me it was like, I, I had the same thing growing up. It was like, I, I, I was driven by just like, kind of this and I was, I, it was push, it was like this pushing energy. It was like, I'm always pushing and I'm grinding and I grew up in this broken home situation, so I was like, I'm prove myself. I got on the rugby field and I fucking tore it up as an athlete. It was just this like aggressive energy and I, it was all about pushing. And then for me at one point it was like, wait a minute, I also be pulled. And being pulled feels a lot better. And what I started getting pulled by was more about, I started thinking about Like, Purpose. Like, why am I here? Why am I alive? Like, what's, what's my purpose? And can I allow that to start pulling me? And just the energy of it just feels different.

Track 1: 17:25

Yeah, that's a really good point. And I feel like, I feel like part of that is also just like being okay with asking other people for help and not having to do everything by yourself. Because I think some people get so stuck in perfecting something, especially in music, that they never even finish the, a song, you know what I mean? The, the song needs to be perfect. It's like the, one of the things I am so grateful for and I value so much, is just like my circle of people, like friends, other musicians and stuff. I'm like, Hey, like, does this sound? Is this done? And they're like, yeah, it sounds done. Cool, it's done.'cause I will continue tweaking it for, they have friends who do that, you know, they

Nik: 18:08

Yeah.

Track 1: 18:09

years on stuff. And not to say that I haven't done that too, but

Nik: 18:13

Dude, I'm doing it, I'm doing it right now with this fucking program I've been trying to build. I've been like, yeah, I'm gonna, January it's launching. I'm, I've been talking about it on the podcast, and I'm like, I have, I've had so much resistance to actually sitting down and making all of it, and I was like, oh, like I'm trying to thing perfect and I got, I've got, I've got caught up and like, wait. It's, it's, I gotta loosen my grip on, on it needing to be perfect and just it to be what it's gonna be and allow it to be, you know, enough and put it out and, and, you know, get it, get it, going. Right. I feel like I spent so much of my life trying to control, um, the outcome of things. And you have, you just don't have any control. And I mean, not to say that I don't still do that,'cause I do, I'm like, you know, for, for instance, it's like I'm doing this album tour that starts in almost a month, and I want it to be a certain way where I want, you know, I want tickets to sell a certain way and blah, blah blah.

Track 1: 19:10

And it's like, I have no control of what anybody else is doing. I can try to influence it as best as I can, but it, life is so much less stressful if you just do what you want to do and let the universe just like decide what's gonna happen. Because

Nik: 19:27

Yeah.

Track 1: 19:28

there's this quote, you know, it's like I'm not like getting into God and religion and stuff, but it's like you make plans and God laughs in your face, you know, which I love.'cause you know, I believe in a higher power and that I'm not the one in control. And it's also just like, if I try to remind myself of that, it makes life so much less stressful.'cause it's like, well if I'm not in control, then like I can just only do my best and, and whatever comes from that, comes from that, I need to be okay with it. Because we only really can control ourselves and we can't control anything else. We can't control how. Other people feel about something or, or anything else. I mean, there was a lot of times where I was like, oh, I'm upset that, that this happened and, and that I felt a certain way about it, you know? But it's like, I just felt how I felt and that's okay. I can't, I can't get upset that I had a knee jerk reaction to somebody. That's just how I felt. And, and then that's okay.

Nik: 20:30

yeah. And it doesn't serve us. It's like we feel a certain way and beat ourselves up for feeling we certain way. it's like just doubling on it. It's like, like, I feel bad, and now I feel bad about feeling bad. Yeah. It's like, why am I gonna beat myself up over over something I have no control over, you know, I stem the way I am. I have these moments where I just, I take a step back and I observe myself and I always just say, look at you, silly human. Just, you just being such a fucking silly human, like, like, you know, being mad at yourself for being mad. You know, it's like take a step back and just fucking laugh at myself sometimes in those moments I love doing that. I, I feel like it's such a good way to get out of that head space too. Like, look how fucking crazy I am. Cool. You know, and Look, let's, let's take a step back. I want to come back to the William Black process for artistic success. Step one, we got step one down, which is cut out the bullshit, right? Uh, as one of my mentors and coaches would say, we have to separate to elevate, If you wanna elevate to that next level in your life, you gotta separate yourself from the things no longer serve you. You gotta separate yourself from the drugs, from the alcohol, from the toxic relationships. You gotta separate yourself from the bullshit excuses, right? And that victim mindset that says, oh, I can't do it. Or things are unfair, things are too hard, or whatever. All right, so, step one, you gotta cut out. Cut the shit out. cut the bullshit. what, that's what we're gonna call it. Cut the, cut the That's All right. Um, I feel like we already hit on like five other fucking steps in, in the last know, 10, 15 minutes. No, no, no. But what would you, what would you say is, is step two.

Track 1: 22:18

so step one is cut the bullshit. Then step two for me was figure out, Elaine, that I want to go into in terms of how to get what I want. What, what if what I want is to become a musician and a music producer, how do I get there? So how do I learn how to make music? That's step two is, is fucking sit down and bust your ass and, and just teach yourself or go somewhere that's gonna teach you. I think for me that was, you know. I got sober and then I went to music school. That was step two for me. So

Nik: 22:55

Yeah. Learn, learn, learn. and, and, and. Yeah. Learn, learn and put in the and put in the hours too. Right? Like you really, you really had to, to put that work in. I mean, it sounds like having iCONN really helped with that, like having structure and support, you know. I mean, I had no idea how to make music before I went to Icon, and that doesn't mean that when I left Icon, I was like some amazing producer. No, my music still sounded like shit, but I still ha I had like a, a crash course into making music. And so I was like, okay, I just learned some fundamentals. Now I need to figure out how I can learn more.

Track 1: 23:34

Whether that was from other people, which was, I think for me, the biggest help was I, I met one of my best friends there and he was a better musician than me and he taught me a lot of stuff just by working together, hanging out, um, together and. YouTube, you know, I mean, nowadays fucking YouTube is the best,

Nik: 23:55

yeah, yeah, yeah. I think that that getting support is really important. You know, where. piece It's like you can speed up the process so much more by learning from other people, working with other people. You know, if someone else has spent years figuring it out, need to also, you know, like get, like jump. You can skip levels like Mario, right? Speed the process.

Track 1: 24:18

why Yeah. You don't have to do everything alone. You know, it's funny, you know, especially in, in pop music. Like you, a pop song is probably written by six people and produced by three and performed by one, so, and that's like a low level.

Nik: 24:35

yeah, we forget that. Did any, yeah. Any like, massive, massive song, uh, very rarely has been made by one person. Yeah. I think that's one of the biggest, uh, traps for, you know, quote unquote music producers is like, just because you can do everything by yourself doesn't mean you should, you. Yeah. Or have to, you know, you Or, have to. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so in, in terms of learning, step number two, you gotta learn, you gotta, you gotta learn, you master your craft, you gotta put in the work, put in the hours, right? What, contributed to you really being able to do that? Well, because I do see this as an area that a lot of people struggle with. Like, there's a lot of resistance, there's a lot of, I don't know, maybe it's excuses, maybe it's fucking 80 a DHD. It's like being able to just sit down and do the fucking work and really pour yourself into it, uh, is definitely something I, I think a lot of people struggle with. What kind of tips or advice would you have for somebody that is maybe feeling challenged with really and putting in that work? I would say that, you know, and I didn't do this, so I'm gonna tell you why I think it's important. But I was like, okay, I learned how to make music, so what, for me, what I thought the next step was is I gotta release that music. It's like, no, dude, because the reason that, some people become good musicians.

Track 1: 26:03

I think one of the, the first realizations is that they have a really good taste in music. So if you have a really good taste in music and you know it sounds good and you're making a song. It doesn't sound good as, as good as the music that you like listening to, then you're not ready to release music. So I feel like for me, how I got as good as I am at making music is I just spent years working on music. Make a song cool. I made a song, put it somewhere else, start another song and just keep doing that. And the, the more I worked on music, the better my music got. And there was a time period where I didn't worry about releasing music. I think like 2014 to 2016. I worked on music all the time, every day, and I didn't release anything, you know, because I realized that I wanted my, my music to sound on the same level as my favorite artist. And if it didn't, then I wasn't good enough.

Nik: 27:02

Hmm. Yeah, that's, that's a really good perspective that I think is actually very rare because I think a lot of people are so hungry and eager and excited for success play shows and be be in the scene that it's like, okay, cool, I just made my first song. How do I get it out there and, and build my audience, you know, rather than, oh, let me go make 50 more. I think that's like the, that's like a huge misconception of what, what you need to do. And that's not to say that I didn't do that too. I mean, I totally did and I totally, put out some songs that I listened back to and I'm like, this sounds awful. And you know, the goal wasn't how do I become really good at making music?

Track 1: 27:53

It was, how do I. Perform and be in the scene and go on tour and stuff. And I looked at it, the, you know, I looked at it the wrong way,

Nik: 28:03

It sounds like you kind of dedicated yourself to the art rather than just the, the, business and building your, you know, your brand and your audience. But having that intention to really like make the best music possible is, a fork in the road. yeah, I think my goal changed a few years in where it was like, at first I just wanted to make EDM and be a dj, you know, and then I realized that after I've written music for a few years, that although I did do want, still want to do those things, it kind of progressed into it like, okay, well I really just, I want write music that.

Track 1: 28:50

That can help people or that can evoke some emotion from people. And just in the same way that my favorite songs do for me, because I, you know, after being sober for a little bit and the brain fog kind of lifting, I realized like, these songs that I really love, like, why do I love these songs? It's because they make me feel something. And I want to, I want to be able to do that. I want to be able to make people feel something for music. So how can I, how can I do that with my music? And then the journey became more of like, how can I write that specific kind of music that's, that I resonate with, number one, that's important to me, and that hopefully other people can resonate with too.

Nik: 29:32

Yeah. Yeah. And how,'cause I hear so many people say that because I think it's such a common journey, is like you start off, start off in the crowd and you have experience in the crowd, and you're like, oh my God. Like I'm having my, my life changed, my soul is being touched. And then there's this part of you that's like, I want to do that for other people. I want to, share that gift too. And I hear so many artists talk about that, wanting to impact people with their music, wanting to love with their music, or create emotion with their music. But I think that's also easier said than done, For sure. A hundred percent. I think for me, what I realized is the only way I can do that is if I am being vulnerable with my fans and in my music and in a session where you say, Hey, like, what do you wanna write about? What do you wanna write about today? I'm in a session running, so it's like, oh, I wanna write about this traumatic thing that happened to me that, you know, maybe some people wouldn't really feel comfortable sharing, but for me, found that the, music for me is almost like, you know, like a journal.

Track 1: 30:43

It's like, how do I, how do I write? about things that happened to me, in a song, you know, instead of just talking about what happened, I get to, not only talk about it, but form a, a piece of music from it, which I think is important. And I think, you know, my first, my first album, you know, sometimes artists put out songs that, and they, they don't want to tell the fans what what it meant means to them because they want people to form their own opinion about what the song means, you know?

Nik: 31:20

Mm-Hmm.

Track 1: 31:21

But I kind of did the opposite of that. And with all the singles from my first album, I put out a little blurb about what the song meant to me and, and what it's about to me. And that doesn't mean that it can't be about something else to somebody else, but I. I just feel like being, being vulnerable and talking about what I'm going through, what I've gone through that inspired the song has, has been really impactful. And I think now I know that, that my fans have appreciated that.'cause they tell me that like, Hey, thank you for being open. Thank you for talking about your experience. Like here's a si similar experience I've had. And when I got sober there, I did the 12 steps and the last one is helping others. So I thought the only way I can truly help myself is if I'm going outta my way to helping other people. So I thought, what better way to do that than with what I'm passionate about, which is music.

Nik: 32:17

Yeah, man, that was, it's so cool you're bringing that up right now. I, I literally just finished listening to a book today called Story of Your Life, and it's all about dharma, which is purpose, which is why are we here? Why do we exist as spiritual this human experience, you know, why are we alive? Why we created? You know, and a lot of what it talks about of like when you're actually really aligned with your purpose, a piece of that is service is that it's not about, about you. It's not, it's, it's when you get to the point that your work, you know, for something bigger and, and it is in service some way. And it got me about artists and about How that is a perspective that's available, and not just a perspective, but a an authentic lane of living and existing, and a path to take if, if, if you choose for this path to really about you and not be about a, the money you can make and the shows that you can play and the adventure that you can go on, but actually really seeing yourself as this is a gift that I have been chosen to bring to the world and it is my sacred duty to bring this energy, you know, from the universe and, and, and share it and be, and really doing it a place of service. I think that's a fucking powerful, powerful idea.

Track 1: 33:50

I think it's also one of the, one of those things that's easier said than done because, you know, I get caught up in, in everything in life, and unfortunately with music you've got this whole other side of it, which is the numbers side of it, and the plays and the likes and

Nik: 34:09

Yeah.

Track 1: 34:10

and,

Nik: 34:10

It's your career.

Track 1: 34:12

and you know, I've talked to actually, I was talking to my, my girlfriend about it because she brought up something that was interesting because I am. A lot of times, especially during the Covid lockdowns, I would, you know, Like, my success would be equated by how many likes I got. You know? And, and because there were no shows and there wasn't anything happening, and there had no real physical interaction with the people that are listening to my music. I was like, oh, that post got only X amount of likes. Like, people don't care about me anymore, you know? Which is such a dangerous thing to be on. And, it's such bullshit. I mean, it's just like, social media is such an important thing, but it's also so awful, you know? And what, what my girlfriend said was that, you know, she works, A normal nine to five job.

Nik: 35:07

And she's like, I can do or do without social media and, and it's not important in my career how, how much I post or how good of engagement I get. And she's like, so I told her, I was like, if I wasn't an artist, I probably would never use Instagram or, or Twitter or anything. I just would about that often. They're like, there's actually some people out there that never open up these apps. I'm like, what is their life like? you, I could. My dad, Yeah. Just living in ignorant bliss,

Track 1: 35:41

It's, that sounds nice,

Nik: 35:44

Yeah, but it's not our path, man. not.

Track 1: 35:46

No it's

Nik: 35:47

it's our

Track 1: 35:49

So I have to, you know, you have to, it's one of those things where it's like, all right, well I don't love doing this, but it's an ends do or a means to an end. And so It's, it's one of those things you just put up with because you know it serves a higher purpose, which is

Nik: 36:03

that's it. that's it. man. I think that really is shift of when the perspective get out of your ego and being about me and it's like, oh, these, these likes are about me and my worthiness and, you know, or the success or the money or whatever it may be. And really be living in that energy service and, serve means that I have to show up and do work and give, have it not be about me. And, uh, yeah, again, yeah, it's, it's easier said than done, but I think There's actually a lot of freedom in that perspective and in that choice to, to kind of take that path because yeah, you get, it's like your fucking ego outta the way. It's like, all right, it's not, it's not, about me. This is, this is why I'm here, and it's about something bigger. Mm-Hmm. Yeah. Yeah, And I think, you know, what's interesting is, is that, is that, you know, I, with my experience with music and spending years perfecting my craft and, and still, you know, I'm still learning. If you ever think that you, you've learned it all, then you're, you've, you're probably fucked because you can always learn more.

Track 1: 37:16

Um, and we're always changing. But on the flip side of that, there's a guy who made music for a year and made a cool song and posted, and now he's touring the world, you know, so everybody's experience will be different. But,

Nik: 37:31

Totally.

Track 1: 37:32

I feel like for me, what I wanted is to make not only make music that impacts people, but to make music that's gonna, that I'm still gonna be proud of when I listen to it 40 years from now, hopefully.

Nik: 37:47

I love that. And it, and it's a good reminder, and that's what I said at the beginning of the, of the call there, path is different. There's no one size fits all. Like there's a lot of people out there. It's like, yo, you just want to some bangers and play some clubs and have your, your whole thing be about just having fun and have it not, it doesn't have to be serious and dharma and life you know, like, that's cool, that's cool, Right? But, you know, I think, uh, right now I'm, I'm really speaking to, the artists that do feel called on that deeper level to be, um, to be really in that, in that place of, of service and, and dharma. So, so far our process is cut the bullshit, dedicate yourself to learning. Mm-Hmm. What's step number three?

Track 1: 38:33

I feel like you gotta take, you gotta take the leap for me. which was, for me, the leap was 20. 2018, I had been working full-time and also playing shows and, you know, putting out music and sort of making a little bit of a name for myself, but not making enough money to support myself from music, so still to work. and it was the, my going in from 2018 to 2019, I had lined up a, a string of shows that I was going to lose money on, but still, it was like, okay, I'd have to take like two weeks off of work. And it just, like, that thing popped in my head where I was like, if I don't quit my job and just figure it out, then I am, I'm never gonna quit. And I did and I quit my job. And that year, 2019 was like kind of crazy for me because I went. And I had already started working on an album, but I pretty much, that year, I finished my first album. I went on tour with Adventure Club. It was a two week, two or three week tour. I was on a bus, I was playing a lot of shows. then I put out my album and then immediately went on tour with Millennium and did a full like us tour with him. And so that decision to like, take the leap, I mean, who knows, but I feel like, because I was like, this has to happen. Then

Nik: 40:09

Yep.

Track 1: 40:10

the universe provided,

Nik: 40:12

Yes, sir. Yes, sir. That's such a fucking big lesson, so glad that you brought that up because there's that saying, leap the net will appear, right Take the leap and know and trust that you will be supported by miracles and synchronicity and divine energy. And wild man, because I mean, there's so many countless people that have the same story where they're like, I didn't know how. I didn't how it was gonna work, but I took the leap and miraculously like shit kind of worked out. You know what I mean? You hear it all the time and it's a fucking scary thing. But also think about how many people are like still on that edge and, and living in that state of what if and fear and scarcity and tension and it's like, man, it, it only takes one time of taking the leap and having it work out that you're like, you just, I don't know. At least for me it's like I've, I've taken a good handful of leaps, but I'm like, now I just fucking jump now. I'm like, I It'll, work out. It'll work out somehow. know It'll but it's going to, you It's gonna happen the it's gonna happen. You, you just gotta, you gotta, it's scary as fuck. But yeah, you gotta trust that. And I think when you also actually have that belief that like, yo, there is some other bigger universal force out there. Call it God, call it the universe. Call it whatever the fuck it. Call it. Call it Joe Schmo, whatever you wanna call it.

Track 1: 41:36

Sure. Yeah.

Nik: 41:37

out there and, and it will hook you up if you just demonstrate that you are willing to life with courage. live your I love that. And I will say, funnily enough, one of the reasons I was able to pay rent, in 2019 is because I met at my time at Icon named Nick said, Hey, uh, I got this DJ who needs some help with his music. I wanted to put you two in touch, which was you. So you put me in touch with somebody who needed help with their music.

Track 1: 42:11

I helped with their music and they paid me. And I was like, cool, I have money now, and I couldn't pay rent. So thank you for that.

Nik: 42:17

Hell yeah. Hell yeah, man. I'm glad. that worked out. I'm glad I don't remember that, fucking stoked to hear that. I get to play a small, small, little, uh, snippet in your journey, man. And it's funny though, I just like it is those, it's like a, it's like culmination of these little, you know, these little things that, uh, I dunno, just support shows up in unexpected ways sometimes, Well, you know, it, it, it's funny because I, I, I said it earlier, but I, you know, I thought that before I like got sober, I was like, I think getting sober is gonna hold me back from being an artist.'cause what's, being a DJ and touring and partying and getting fucked up and having a good time, but I can pinpoint why me getting sober was the single best decision I ever made in, in my life in terms, especially in regards to my music career because.

Track 1: 43:12

Uh, you know, number one, I, I was able to focus and do all the other steps, but it's also just like chance and luck and, you know, call it that if you want. But one of the artists that helped me the most in my career and continues to is, is Millennium. And the only reason I met him is because of a mutual friend who's not in music at all that was also sober and was like, Hey, you should meet my friend, Will, like, he's making music too. He is sober. Nick Millennium is sober too. the rest is, you know, the rest is history. But, uh, I know that I, I wouldn't have been put in that position if I had never gotten sober, which is kind of, you know, kind of insane to think about. Where would I, I sometimes think about that. Where would I be if X, Y, and Z didn't happen in, in this weird order? so. I think it's a good lesson for myself as to if something might not feel right in the moment, it could be setting you up for something that's gonna really be great for your life in X amount of years.

Nik: 44:21

Yeah. it comes back to trust. Trust the process, have faith,

Track 1: 44:28

Yeah,

Nik: 44:29

so you started shows and going on tour in 2019, and so you only had a little bit of time and then happened and were no shows. how was that, that must have been, I imagine, kind of tough to start getting that momentum and then just have all of it, stop, you know, how'd you, how'd you handle that and get through that pandemic Excuse me. Uh. Somehow I did you know, like everybody. But, um, my plan for 2020 was very different. Obviously I was, had a whole tour planned for my first album, and I was going to go on tour and then start working on music. But instead I said, okay, well have all this time off. Nobody's touring. I, I, I need to be productive.

Track 1: 45:22

And I had all this time, you know, alone to reflect. And so I just started another album and I just wrote music. And it wasn't, I'm not saying it was like a breeze. There were definitely like, it was hard, man. I mean, it was just like, I felt like I was really onto something with my, you know, with my momentum. I had booked, I. Bonnaroo and Lollapalooza and these festivals. And I was going on my own tour and people were really excited and I was really excited and I was like, I hope this doesn't deter You know? And I wasn't sure. I didn't know, you know, I didn't know if it would. And luckily I had kept working on things and during Covid I put out, uh, back To You with Slander, which is still like my biggest song because it's a great song. And, uh, that helped a lot that, that that song was released on, uh, insomniac, like run label. And so they started, they asked me to come do their like livestream thing, which I thought was weird, but I was like, you know, I'm here in la. I should do it. And I got a new bunch of new fans from that. I did a couple of, I did a couple of those live stream things and as weird as they were, like, I think everybody was home. So it was, it was really cool for me to like, don't know, almost like make new fans of people who wouldn't necessarily even know who I am, but everybody's home and they're watching this live stream thing and

Nik: 47:05

Yeah. Yeah,

Track 1: 47:07

his album, you know?

Nik: 47:08

totally. Yeah, I was just, I was just talking to a client this morning about the fact, and this is a fact. Shit's always gonna happen.

Track 1: 47:18

yeah.

Nik: 47:19

like unexpected curve balls. Are a, shouldn't be unexpected. Expect them. They're fucking coming no matter what. You know, like things are not to go as planned. And so when we can actually just know and accept that and expect that there's less resistance to it, it's like then the quicker, like we have to be flexible, the quicker we can adapt and move and adjust and say, okay, well I thought it was, this was gonna happen and it didn't, and now I'm over here, what can I do now? Right. And that, that right there, being adaptable, being flexible, being, you know, not being stuck in, uh, being attached to things, you know, needing to be a certain way or work out in a certain way.'cause they're just fucking, they're not going to all the time. So it was like, we have to be able to adjust. And so it's, uh, it's cool to see that you're like, all right, cool. Well let me, you know, a lot of people spiraled out and were like, oh, my career's over and, and fell into it. And you're like, okay, lemme go. I'm, go write an album now. I'll go do some livestreams now. So that's, that's pretty cool that you were able to do that. I never actually looked at it that way. I think it was just, uh, just a force of habit. But I You saying that I realized like, wow, I could have really. could have really spiraled Oh, done that. So I'm glad I, A lot of people did. Yeah. a lot of people did. man. So, all right. Coming back. back to our process. Cut the bullshit. Dedicate yourself to learning. Take the leap. What's number four?

Track 1: 48:50

I feel like I'm in number four right now.

Nik: 48:52

Yeah, what's that?

Track 1: 48:53

many steps, how many steps are there total?

Nik: 48:57

I don't know many, episodes you wanna do how many how but yeah. What, what step are you now What's, what's in then? leap and then just, uh, Hold on for dear life, yeah, basically I was just, just pray to God that, that it worked. No, I mean, I think. Well, a lot of things come with, um, with having, you know, say you take the leap and you and you've got some success. I think a lot of things come with that. And, you know, I think one thing that people forget and, you know, I've forgotten over time, is why they started doing it in the first place.

Track 1: 49:37

And, and it was because of the passion and, and this higher purpose for music.'cause I think quickly you can go from not playing any shows, not making any money to doing, making a lot of money and playing a lot of shows. And I think it's can be easy to That's was not the goal. You know, making money wasn't the goal. At least for me. It was like, I hope that I can make a living off of music, but it quickly, you can go from, I'm now making a living from music to. Why am I not making this much money? Why am I not doing this? And like, I think maybe 1% of people who do music actually make a living off of music and, and probably even less than that, make a living off of music, making music that they're actually passionate about. There's a lot of jobs you can do in music, but that doesn't mean you're, you're making music that you love and you get to pay rent or buy a house or do whatever from that. So I think if I had to pick a step four, it would be to try to stay grounded and stay humble and surround yourself with people that are gonna call you out on your bullshit and not just gonna tell you what you want to hear. Because there are a lot of those people that when you start getting success, they're gonna be like, yeah, man, like blah, blah, blah.'cause they're just looking out for their own, they're Fairweather friends and they don't actually care about you as a person. So I think I. Finding a good team and, and circle of people that care about you and your best interests is really important.

Nik: 51:17

Hmm. Yeah. And care about the actual art and the purpose behind it, just the, the money. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Powerful stuff, man. What, what a just great lesson and, and and insight. What are some of the other challenges that you see at this stage as you are, you know, you're at a place of touring and making money and, you know, you've reached success, but that also comes with a, a new set of challenges. What are some of the challenges, you know, now at this stage in your life and career?

Track 1: 51:56

I think it's still, you know, reminding myself that to make music for me and not, and not for what I think somebody who likes my music wants to hear. and honestly just to, to live in the moment and enjoy what's happening. So I don't look back and be like, fuck, I just spent that whole time worrying about what could happen. I want to enjoy, like, I want to stay present and enjoy it while it's happening. And that doesn't mean I can't want more, but it's just like, if we spend all of our time looking to what could come, then we're gonna miss what's happening right in front of our face. Because I look back and, you know, I've, that when I went on tour with Millennium in 2019 as one of the best, if not like, you know, top five moments of my life, I was on the, on a bus tour with some of my best friends, playing huge shows all over the country. And before I went on the tour, I like made a conscious. Decision, like, I am going to enjoy this and I'm going to live in the moment and not worry about what's gonna come up after it, because I have no control over that. And I felt like because I did that had such a better time, you know?

Nik: 53:15

Yeah, yeah. Setting that intention is so important. And that's also something I talk to clients about a lot as well. Uh, especially, I, I always, I always say this, um, like networking of like when somebody's going out. They're like, oh, I want to, you know, I always, I always remind'em like, yo, if you're gonna go out and you want to really like network and meet people, like set that before you go, or your intention, maybe is to like, have fun. My intention tonight is to really just go have fun, and it's to be present. It's like, okay, but just taking that moment before doing anything. could be before a big meeting, right? Before I go into this meeting, how do I want to be, how do I wanna show up? What do, what do I want the outcome to be? Rather than just showing up and hoping it the way you want it to. You know, it's like coming in unintentionally versus actually taking some time to really be like, all right, this is, this is how I want to feel. This is how I want to be. This is what I want the result to be. Let me remind myself of that. Let me see that like in my mind and, step into it. So I love that. I love that. And, and seeing that it, it works. You actually were able to be present and have fun. That's awesome. I feel like I kind of forgot that I even did that until maybe a few weeks ago when I was stressing about my upcoming tour, and I'm like, you know what? Like this tour is gonna be a big deal, and it's the biggest step I've tried to take and I want to enjoy it. And so I'm gonna try to do the same, same thing, which is.

Track 1: 54:48

Have fun because the whole reason I started making music is'cause it was fun to do. You know, if I'm not having fun, what the hell am I doing? You know?

Nik: 54:58

For sure.

Track 1: 54:58

think it's so easy to forget that,

Nik: 55:01

And whatever you focus on is gonna grow. Whatever you feed your energy to, you're giving more energy to. So we can focus on all of the uncontrollables, am I gonna sell enough tickets? am I gonna have the right? production? Are things going to, you know, and we can imagine all these scenarios and it's like, all right, that's what we're focusing on. We're gonna feed energy to it, and we're gonna feel that in our body, we're gonna, you know, we're gonna, you're gonna create anxiety for ourselves. And or we can also focus on damn, how, how many, how many people are gonna be like front row and fucking crying and just like having the best time of their lives and, and how many new friends am I gonna make? And, and how much fun am I gonna have up there? You know, like that, that mastery of what we to focus on, you know, the mind can just fucking off course sometimes, but if we can really like

Track 1: 55:47

me,

Nik: 55:49

I mean, I think that's the endless quest, you know, how do we try to redirect ourselves and, you know, also, again, not beat ourselves up when it does run off course, but be like, oh, let me, let me come back over here and focus on what I want rather than what I don't want.

Track 1: 56:03

Yeah.'cause I think we, you know, I know from myself I can set unrealistic expectations. And the problem with, like we were talking about before with numbers and, and, things that's, music is not a, it's not a competition, but it can kind of be looked at, especially in the EDM spaces. Ooh, this person sold X amount of tickets, or it sold out this many days in advance and blah, blah, blah. And well, how, how does that, how is my worth? Like, does that mean he's bigger than me? Am am I bigger than him? And, and who fucking cares?'cause there's no, there's no Trophies for who was the biggest DI mean, actually there are, but nobody, the DJ mag top 100 is a joke. So don't,

Nik: 56:46

yeah, yeah, yeah,

Track 1: 56:47

But, but I'm saying personally, it's like I rem I caught myself being like, oh, this show, this show, and this show needs to sell out and I'll be happy. And then I was like, wait, what the fuck? No. Like, you know, if the, if the venues hold 3,500 people and I sold hundred ninety nine tickets, that mean now I'm not gonna be happy. You know, like, I think I need, I needed to change my view of what, what a successful show was for me. Was it everybody who came had an amazing time and I had an amazing time, or the show was sold out and maybe nobody had a fun time there. You know, like what? What's, what's the more important thing? And I, I've been over the last, I wanna say month, like just kind of trying to rewire my brain into what I think a successful show is. Because a lot of people think that it's the number part, you know, how many tickets were sold and you know, maybe that plays a small part into it. But that shouldn't be the only only decision maker for what is a successful night on a

Nik: 58:00

so so what's your new definition of a successful show?

Track 1: 58:05

If I have fun and the people who are there have fun, that's a successful show,

Nik: 58:08

yeah. Boom. Yeah. It's like, make it easier to be happy and to be fulfilled. Let's not set up roadblocks and barriers. I'll be happy when these things happen. Let's make it simple. I, I'll be happy I have fun and they have fun. Right. let's not cock block ourselves from let's not

Track 1: 58:29

Yeah. You don't have to set, set all the roadblocks to, to achieve, you know? And, and not every, you know what, I think a big, a big realization I had just over the last 10 years is that, you know, not everything is gonna be happy. You know, and but on the flip side of that, it's like we have to experience things that make us sad or, or mad or angry to know what it feels like to be happy.'cause it's all relative. And if you don't know what feeling sad was, then you wouldn't know what feeling happy was. It has, you have to have the, the opposite. So if something happens that makes you sad or, or doesn't go the way you want it to, just know that that is necessarily in your necessary, in your life for you to experience

Nik: 59:18

yeah. It's the, full spectrum of the human experience. We don't get one without the other, you know? Yeah. Well, man, what. Awesome. Amazing, beautiful, inspirational wisdom. We now have the official William Black process for artistic artistic success. Step one, cut the bullshit. Cut out the fucking excuses. Cut out the drugs and the alcohol and the distractions, all that stuff. Step one, cut the bullshit. Step two, dedicate yourself to learning. Step three, what was step three?

Track 1: 59:53

Take the loop.

Nik: 59:55

Take the fucking leap. Trust have faith leap, and the net will appear. And then step four, stay grounded and stay humble when you get there. Yeah.

Track 1: 1:00:05

I like that list.

Nik: 1:00:07

Yeah. Yeah, man. Well, thank you so much for sharing that. Thank you so much for hopping on today and, and sharing. so good to see you. It's so good to reconnect, and I'm just, I'm so happy to see you. You know, not only, not only, you know, living the dream and being successful, but really who you've become as a person in the process. I think that's the biggest fucking win of all.

Track 1: 1:00:27

Thanks, man. I, I, this was really fun and nice to just talk about, you know, something other than what's the new release and blah, blah, blah. Just to dive into emotions and, and process. It's just been, it was really fun. So I appreciate you having me on.