NIKITA THE WICKED - The New Villain Of Dance Music

From dropping out of grad school to crushing festival stages — Nikita the Wicked is proving that the real win comes when you stop following the rules and start following your calling.

In this episode, we get into the story behind his rise, how he built a viral artist brand without a label and why bringing your full personality into your project is what separates artists from entertainers.

We talk about:

• What it really takes to walk away from the “safe” path
• The moment he knew grad school wasn’t for him
• How he built a team around his project 
• Building a character, a brand, and a movement in bass music
• The importance of staying inspired and avoiding burnout as a creator

If you're an artist trying to find your sound, your lane, or your voice — this conversation will remind you that you don’t need permission to go all in.

Follow Nikita The Wicked here:
https://www.instagram.com/nikitathewicked
https://www.tiktok.com/@nikitathewicked

Follow Nik Cherwink here:
https://www.instagram.com/nikcherwink

And visit my site to join the mailing list or book a free coaching call:
https://www.nikcherwink.com

Transcript

0:00

there's gonna be a time where. Your parents aren't gonna get it. Your friends aren't gonna listen to it. No one's really gonna care, but as long as you care, that's all that matters.

Nik Cherwink: 0:23

What's up everybody? Welcome to the Headliner Mindset podcast. This week's guest is one of the hottest rising acts in the bass music scene. In this episode, we talk about his creative process behind his hit records, the inspiration behind his brand and his courageous decision to drop out of grad school and go all in on his artist project. This is Nikita the wicked.

0:42

Nikita, welcome to the show. I'm so stoked that you're here and, and when I mean here, literally here you are. Literally here. I'm here with me for everybody listening on Spotify. We're here in Austin, alive and in the Flesh. Yes. I love it. Yeah, super hyped to be here. My first time in Austin as well. First time in Austin and kind of first podcast too. Yeah, a small one a few years ago. Yeah, just a small one with a really good friend of mine, but yeah, it was like the first like official one, so yeah. Yeah, dude. Hell yeah. Excited. I feel very honored. Thanks so much for being down to, to hop on. Yeah. Hell yeah, man. Um, I would love to start off by just hearing a bit about your story. Like when did you start producing music? What got you into it? Sure. Yeah, man, I, uh, I started producing music in high school actually around 20 16, 20 17. I was making hip hop beats that were just terrible. Um, that, that was like very, what I first started with hip hop was always my first love. And then I went to college at the University of South Carolina and got really into. DJing. Yeah. And kind of in my earlier years of college, I put producing aside, I was just DJing at all the parties around there. And then towards the end I kind of saw that like DJing can only get you so far. Yeah. Without actual production. So that senior year, July, 2020 is when I started to key the wicked going into my senior of college, and I just like really went into it. I was just like taking notes to start my day, going to class, coming back. Producing music for like four hours and then like playing shows at night. So that was kinda like my daily routine. Damn. And so at that point, did you have. The vision and, and the goal of being like, I, I really want to do this. I want to actually become like a professional artist and dj, or was it still kind of a, a hobby that you were having fun with? I think it was definitely at the time, it was something I really took seriously, especially at like South Carolina where dance music wasn't very prevalent. It felt like people maybe didn didn't understand it as much, but I definitely knew that this is like all I wanted to kind of learn about and just like evolve Yeah. With it. So, yeah. And, and then. You went to grad school after that? I did. Well, so I was really curious to dig into this because I am, you know, this is the headliner mindset. Sure. I am all about, you know, mental health and wellness. Yep. And, and the just yeah. The, the, the mindset side of, you know, just success and even just being human navigating, like the, that, that, that stuff. And so you went to grad school for psychology? Clinical psychology. Clinical psychology. So what was your vision with that? And I guess your inspiration to, to, to. Go in that direction. Yeah. So I went to, uh, Palo Alto University. It's a really small school, um, right by Stanford, and I was just there for, it was a two year program to go into therapy. Mm-hmm. Um, because I, my undergrad was, uh, experimental psychology, so I knew like the next route for academic wise was to get into grad school. And I just knew that wherever I wanted to, like, wherever, like psychology took me, I, I just knew I had to be in California. So like I just knew that California was where I had to be. I think internally I knew like. I wanted to do music and I need to be in California, and school was just a way to get me there. It made my parents happy that I was like, oh my God, you under grad school? And so I was like, that kind of brought me there. But yeah, I see. That's how it went. I see. Okay. So there was almost like an unconscious pole, like I think so I'm supposed to be here in the entertainment capital of the world. I think so, yeah. Right. Okay. And so. Was there, there was also a part of you though, that like, wanted to become a therapist. You know, I, I think there was a part of me internally that saw a career path within psychology. I felt like even in undergrad, I, I, I found the coursework very, I liked learning about it, um, to like, I really liked the, like learning about it in the classes, but it really came down to once I did my first internship. Um, at the, in grad school where I really was not. Yeah, I, I, I figured it like came to me that this was not the path for me. Yeah. And that was also the time where I was also still working super hard at music at the same time. So it was kind of a split down two roads basically. Yeah. So you were just starting to tell me, uh, of. Cool. Part of your story with like the moment that you decided that you were not gonna continue mm-hmm. With with grad school? Yeah. Share that because I wanna share my story as well. Sure. Because it's actually pretty similar. Yeah. So, I, I didn't finish grad school. Um, I came into grad school. Like I, I completed all my coursework and when I did my first internship where I just said I, I really did enjoy it, I was. I was working at a middle school in the, uh, Tenderloin District of San Francisco. If you dunno what that is, it's like one of the most like dangerous, like kind of bad parts of San Francisco. So I saw a lot of like really messed up things and then just kind of going into this middle school, being a counselor and I just, I. I felt like I was doing a bad job. I felt like my like supervisor thought I was doing a bad job. And what really made me not appreciate it or just made me feel bad was that I knew that these kids needed a counselor who really had a hundred percent of their heart in the crap in the profession. Yeah. And I knew I wasn't in it. Yeah. So it just gave me a lot of anxiety, like a lot of stress and. Fast forward to my second internship. Um, I basically walk into a different internship and on the very first day of orientation, they gave me like 50 to 70 files of just paperwork, paperwork to look at and fill out. And it was just in that moment I stood up and I walked out and I was like, I'm not, I'm not doing this. Yeah, dude. I was kind of the start and, and it's like you can feel it in your body if you know that there's a misalignment. Right. Like there is a calling, there is a purpose, there is a passion and a gift inside of me that wants to come out for you. That's being an artist and making music when you're doing shit that's not in alignment with that. Like, you're gonna feel it, right? And in that moment you, you, that was like the straw that broke the camel's back. It really was. It, it really takes a lot of, I feel like. Courage, I felt like to just be like, I cannot go down this Totally, dude. It takes fucking courage, man. And, and I, it's like I really want to hammer this point home because I think that there's a lot of people, not just artists, but a lot of people that are showing up and doing something every day and they're like, I know this is not. What I was born to do. Yeah. It is like, this is not it, but it's scary. Yeah. It's scary to take that leap. Faith, very scary. It requires a lot of courage. Mm-hmm. It requires, I mean, it really is a leap of faith. You have to have faith. Mm-hmm. You gotta trust that. Like if you follow your bliss, as Joseph Campbell says, follow your bliss and the universe will open doors where there were only walls. Wow. Right. Trust that if I jump, I'll be okay. Mm-hmm. Because you know it like listening to that, that kind of inner conflict, it's like. It's just, it's speaking so loudly. It's speaking so clearly. Not in words, but in feeling. Yeah. Right. And you gotta follow that feeling. Mm-hmm. So for me, I wanna share similarly, I am right outta college. I graduated on Saturday, moved in with a girlfriend on Sunday, started a job at a financial advising firm on Monday. Wow. About two months into this financial advising job, I remember having a call with a friend and she told me how she had, uh, signed up to do LSAT classes to study, to go to law school. Yeah. And she was like, I went to the first day of classes. I sat down in the chair and like halfway through the class I realized. What the fuck am I doing here? Like, this is not for me. Like I just know in my soul, this is not it. Yeah. And she got up in the middle of the class and just left. Mm-hmm. In the middle of it. Mm-hmm. And it hit me like a lightning bolt. I was on my way to meet with like a potential client for this financial advising job, and it just hit me so hard. I was like. This is not it. Yeah. Like this ain't it. Yeah. And so I went on the spot. I told the client like, Hey, thanks for meeting with me, but like I'm about to go quit my job. I just drove into the office, quit the job on the spot. Wow. Came home, told the, told, told my girlfriend. I was like, Hey, like this is not, this is not for me. Mm-hmm. Like I gotta go chase something. Wow. I don't even know what it is, but like, this is not it. Mm-hmm. And so a, a ton of fucking courage. It took a ton of courage. I ended up moving to LA with a thousand dollars and knew one person. Mm-hmm. And you know, a year later had my own office in capital records. Wow. But it's like. It requires that fucking leap of faith. Yeah. And like listening to that voice. So I just love that part of your story. Yeah. That, that you went for it. Yeah. It, it's, it's especially hard, especially in those earlier days of like music production where. Especially like my first six months when I moved to San Francisco and I didn't, I didn't know anyone. I was like 2000 miles away from all my family and friends.'cause I'm from Kentucky and went to school in South Carolina. So I was, I was pretty sad. I didn't know anyone. I was in this program that I didn't know if it was for me, but I was spending all my time making music and doing music production and like one thing I told myself was like, or something I say, I used to teach lessons as well. One thing I would say is like, there's gonna be a time where. Your parents aren't gonna get it. Your friends aren't gonna listen to it. No one's really gonna care, but as long as you care, that's all that matters. What keeps you going in those moments? Just that. Just that belief, that just believe in yourself when no one else will. You just gotta know that you have it. And even like a year or two into the Quila Wicked Project, I knew that in my production that I had. That there was something here and there were just a couple of other artists that were a bit bigger than me, who when they would, you know, follow me like me and be like, yo, you're really good. I was like, okay. That the fact that they think this. Yeah. And I have like 500 monthly listeners at the time means like there could, there could be something here. Yeah. So you just gotta keep going. Yeah. Keep your head down, keep going. What would you say has been your driving force behind. Pursuing this path and this project. It was just something I've, I've always, um, wanted to do since I came to college and started DJing. It was just like, I feel like that feeling of playing live in front of people was something that just. It's like a feeling like, like no other can compare it to such bliss and such happiness where, and especially at a point now where now you get to play your own music and people are singing the lyrics to your songs. It's such a beautiful moment. It's like, how, how could it get better than this? So that's just like, it's just, I just really love playing live and just having my music just like, you know, means something to people. So I think that's what drives me. Yeah. Yeah. Now I'm curious to hear about your creative process. Sure. Because I'll be honest, I'm not. I'm notoriously not the biggest like base head in the world. Sure. I'm more on the house side. Cool. I'm actually a big metal head. That's my, that's kind of my main thing, right. Uh, I'm more like progressive house sort of scene. I'm, I'm definitely, uh. Loving a lot more bass music these days. Mm-hmm. Um, my girlfriend is a huge bass head. Cool. And so she's throwing on playlists and shit, and it was, you know, just relatively recently that she was playing a, a, a, a playlist and like, um, your song, what's the what the, the big song that you have that's like me. Like me, yeah. Right. That song came on. I was like. You know, I did a double take. I'm like, what, what is this? I was like, I like, what the fuck is this? Who is this artist? Like, this is fucking cool. Mm-hmm. And then I was like, okay, cool. Nikita the Wicked Dope. And then, uh, you know, she was playing some other songs or whatever, and then another song comes on. I was like, I was like, is this that same guy? I was like, there's like, and she's like, yeah, this is the same one. And there's a, there's a sound and a vibe and a flavor that's just different. And like you have your own. Energy and spice, you know? Yeah. That it's like, even as like a, like I, I'm just a, you know, again, yeah. A non base head, but just a music person mm-hmm. That I feel like you have something really unique and different mm-hmm. That you're bringing to the scene and that, that, that, that, that you're bringing. So, appreciate it. I wanna like, dig into your creative process. Sure. Right? Mm-hmm. And, um, I guess I'm just curious about what does that look like for you when you, when you sit down, how do you, how do you produce? Where do you draw inspiration? I, I know a lot of artists are. Maybe struggling to find their sound or dealing with creative blocks or, or a big thing is like chasing other sort of sounds. Doesn't sound like you're doing that at all. So what does your process look like? I mean, certain, certainly in the earlier stages it was a bunch of chasing different sounds and trying and pretty, like if you listen to my discography, like I started with like future base and then I made trap and then I went back to future bass and then I made a big house song and then now I'm a bass artist. So like I've kind of been around, yeah. Uh, like different genres. And like I always say to artists, like, when you try to like, produce different genres, it will make your own sound that much better because it shows that you can, you're a very versatile artist and you can take a piece of this style and a piece of that style and put it together, and that's kind of what replicates your sound. Um, I think that's really important. And for me, like I'm a, I'm a big, um. Sample guy in terms of like really digging in the crates and finding something unique. And that's, that really comes from my love of hip hop. Yeah. Um, like the producer of The Alchemist is one of my, um, biggest like inspirations and just the way he samples and chops up these, like some like Japanese record from like 1972. Some like soul stuff. Like I really like doing that. And it's cool because in hip hop they do it so well. But in dance music, it seems like it's not done. Yeah. As enough. Yeah. So I always like, if I'm gonna start something from scratch, I'm gonna like look for some really weird sample and start there. That's kind of how I like to start. Cool. Yeah. Well I love the permission to explore. Yeah, right. Like play with other genres. Mm-hmm. Try different things. You know, I think a lot of people are kind of trying to lock in on their lane and, and that is a. A question I get a lot of like, oh, should I focus on one sound? You know, because like a lot of people say you should have consistency. Mm-hmm. Whereas a lot of people, I think their heart and soul kind of wants to make different shit. Yeah. And it seems like a lot of artists almost don't give themselves permission to do that. Mm-hmm. Play around, make a house song. Yeah. You know, get, get a little. Well,'cause most of the time you don't even know what your sound is. Yeah. And you won't for like a long time. Like it, sometimes the audience knows your sound better than you. Mm-hmm. Like when my fans will hear like the first like five seconds of my song, like, oh, that's a Nikila Wickett song. It's just like, how do they. Know that bef like, that's crazy that they just know the certain production. Mm-hmm. Um, like I, I guess like decisions you make, that's what your sound is. And it's really easy for like a big artist to be like, well, just find your sound and you'll, and you'll break out. It's just like, okay. It's, that's easier said than done. Yeah. Like, you won't really know your sound. This sound will kind of come to you by the decisions you make mm-hmm. While you're making a song. Yeah. That's what I think. You feel like you've found that for yourself now? I, I think so. I, I guess like. I, I like to think I've found my sound and certainly like my friends and my audience seems to really appreciate my sound. I think with this next project, um, that I am about, I'm about to release here soon. My next EP it will definitely fully show the sound that I'm on, basically the songs I've been leading up to this sound, um, that is Nik Le Wicken. I, so I'm really excited for that project. Yeah. Yeah. I'm curious to get your thoughts on this,'cause I see this happen where you find your sound. Mm-hmm. And. You start becoming successful. Mm-hmm. People start liking you for that, and now that's what you're getting booked for. Mm-hmm. That's what you're getting paid for. Mm-hmm. You know, now you're paying the bills with this business that you've created right. Around your sound. Mm-hmm. And sometimes artists can get kind of, uh, pigeonholed or feel the pressure Yeah. To be like, well, I gotta keep doing this thing. Mm-hmm. Because it's working. Mm-hmm. Right. Mm-hmm. Um. And I see some artists that do, and then there's other artists that really allow themselves to continuously reinvent themselves and continue to explore. Mm-hmm. How do you feel about that? What are your thoughts on that? I completely agree. I mean, I'm, I'm well aware. I'm, I'm the bass guy. I'm like, I'm kind of like the new kid on the block in bass music. I'm pretty aware of that, um, title right now. And like, that's cool. Like, I'm, right now I love making bass music and especially, and more of like my style of bass music. Yeah.'cause it's like, I wouldn't really like call my stuff like dubstep or I wouldn't really call it like rhythm or like, even like garage. It's kind of just like. Bits and pieces of all of it. Yeah. Um, I think that's more unique and just the, like, the fact that I started in different genres and now I'm in bass. Like my biggest song before my last ep, the auction was like a deep house record. It was like an art house record. And it's just like, it like. Maybe one day I wanna return to that phase, um, when I've like accomplished everything I want to accomplish in bass music. But right now, like, I totally understand like, this is what's paying the bills. Like you could get burnt out making this style all the time. But I would say like, you know, don't put yourself in a box. And I love it when artists like evolve with sound. Yeah, totally. Um, like it just shows growth, like evolution of an artist I think is really important. Yeah. So, yeah. Well, well, one, I love that it's like. You're making bass music that even non bass heads like Yeah. Which is cool. Yeah. Me being one of them. Uh, but also just, I guess I would, I really, I, I just really want to see everyone continue to evolve. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. Um, to continue. I think that that is the, the role of an artist is to continue to explore. Mm-hmm. Right. And. Your inspiration takes you in a new direction. You gotta have, back to courage, you gotta have the courage. Take that leap of faith. Mm-hmm. Right? Mm-hmm. Like, okay, maybe this is what's familiar and it gets familiar and you know, you build the audience and the following. Yeah. If you have that spark and that calling, like, oh, go make the fucking deep house song. Like, have the courage to do that. A lot of artists don't, especially like if you're fans like really, truly love you, they will ride with you. Yeah. You know, regardless, they'll always appreciate your sound because like, it doesn't make, it doesn't matter if I make. A, a house or like a, a future bass song, like it's still gonna be a Nik the Wicked record at the end of the day. Like those decisions that I make will still be apparent in all, all my songs at the end of the day. Yeah, totally. And so it's obviously about more than just the music these days as well. There's like the audience and, and the social media. Yep. Um, tell me about, I guess, the. brand of Nikita, the Wicked. Sure. And your relationship with social media, that's a, that's a sticking point for a lot of people. Yeah. They really love making music all day, but they don't really want to put themselves out there. What have you been finding, uh, I guess, kind of just works for you and being like authentic with your brand and your marketing and your social media? Yeah, sure. Um, it all really kind of came down to last summer when I released my, my EP independently called, um. I love it when they run. And that was kind of the idea of that was I was like, okay, I know what I'm, I'm gonna wear this red suit and I'm gonna play this like villain character of this project. And then I started this catch phrase that was like, dance music needed a villain. Yeah. So at the end of every video it ended with dance music needed a villain and it was, it was like dance music has a lot of heroes now. It needs a villain. Yeah. And like people really. Appreciated that they like, they understood it. Um, and especially like the Red Sue, like I got to play a character with that project. Um, and I, I think the idea of playing characters is really cool and really not done a lot in dance music as well. Mm-hmm. Um, you know, just, I feel like a lot of people are trying to chase that hit single where I really like that, you know, building a whole project together. So like that last ep, this upcoming one, so I'm planning my next character for this next project too. But in terms of like the content side, like, yeah, I was just kind of like, really. Ingraining this character with it. And like people like always, uh, like comment on like the way I move, like in my videos. Yeah. And when you see me live and like, that's pretty apparent. Like that's just kind of how I digest music. And also like I. Grew up, I did eight years of ballroom dancing, so like I am Oh, cool. I Dan, like my whole childhood was dancing, so like now that I produce, like that's how music comes to me. Like that's just how it is. So, love that man. Yeah, I love that. I think that's a great point. It was like, bring all of yourself into. Your brand, right? Yeah. Like, cool, you've got a background in ballroom dancing. Bring that in. Mm-hmm. You know, you're a ex skateboarder. Bring that in. Yeah. You know, show people who you are. And, and I think that's, uh, yeah, that's, it's, it's all about expression. Mm-hmm. Right. That was something that jumped out at me as well once I started like, following you and, and outside of just listening to the music, but then seeing Yeah, just you and like. Just the vibe and the swag, even like the fashion, you know, I, I, I was like, oh, this guy's got, like, he's got a look. The grandpa style. Yeah, yeah, dude. Which is so cool. It's one of my favorite things actually is contrast. Mm-hmm. When you think of like bass music, there's kind of like a, an aesthetic mm-hmm. That goes with that. Mm-hmm. That is also very overly done. You know, like everyone kind of falls into that same sort of aesthetic. Mm-hmm. And then when. When you pop out, you're like, yeah, I sound like this, but I look like this. Mm-hmm. And it's almost like a pattern interrupt in your brain. Mm-hmm. Which I love. I love when people do that. Yeah. So you nailed that. Thank you. I appreciate it. It's something that a lot of people aren't thinking about really? Yeah. Like, how am I, how am I presenting myself mm-hmm. Visually as an artist. Mm-hmm. You know, and, and style clothing. Like that's a part of it that I think a hundred percent is becoming more and more. Part of the game. It's like, I, I bring this up all the time, but, you know, EDM as a blanket, umbrella term for electronic music is kind of the, the new kid on the block of the major, like food groups, you know, there's rock pop, hip hop, like, but like a rapper's gonna dress like a fucking rapper. They're gonna, they're gonna have, they, they know style is important. Mm-hmm. A pop artist is gonna come out and like, look the part. And I think finally, you know, DJs are starting to like, catch onto that as well. Yeah, yeah. Like. Be an artist. Yeah, yeah, yeah. A hundred percent. Yeah. It's, I think individuality, like the fashion true, like I, it's, it's not even fashion. Like I, Tyler the creator is like a, a huge inspiration of mine. Like the whole character building arc was him, and just like his, his fashion style is something I really. Like, just like just the collared shirts and the slacks. I think it's, it's a really unique vibe, especially in dance music.'cause like all DJs wear our black tees. That's it. Yeah. It's so boring. I can't have it anymore with the black tees. It's so boring. I mean, I get it because like you DJ you sweat and like with the Black Tee, no one's gonna see it, but it's like, I can't, I'm not, yeah. I'm not trying to wear that. I'm just not. I saw, I saw Lane eight last night. Yeah. Really? Which, first off, it was a, no phones allowed. Show. Yeah. Never done that before. It was so sick. Mm-hmm. I'm just, I'm putting this out there. Y'all start doing that if you can. No phones. Like, that was fucking epic. Yeah. No phones allowed. No cameras purely being present. It was, it was so cool. Um, but yeah, he came out, he had like a, a tie on and like socks, like pulled over his, over his, over his pants and shit. It was like, I was like, this guy's doing his own thing. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It was very cool. you're here in Austin. You're playing with Zeds Dead tonight. Awesome. So excited to come out and, and, and see you get down. When did things start to click for you on the Yeah, the, just the, the business side. You have a manager now. You have an agent now. Mm-hmm. When did all of that start coming together for you? Um, yeah, so I got my agents, I have two agents, um, and I got them in the, in July. Of last year, and that really just came from like the promotion of the ep, like in like a span of like two weeks. I went from like 2000 followers to like 10,000 Instagram followers. Wow. Um, that's a big jump. It was a very big jump and like I never went like viral either. Yeah. Like I never had a video that got like 3 million views or something. I was, I got one that got like 80,000, the next one get like maybe 60,000. The next one get like 120,000. So it was like semi like viral, but not like viral. But it felt like it was a really good. Fan base and people who were generally into the, to the style. Um, and so that's where the agent came. And then my manager, I've had since December, 2021, um, she's been a friend of mine for quite some time. I had like 500 monthly listeners and she DMed me on Instagram and was like, listen, I work at like the USC school like, uh, graduate program for uh, like music industry studies. I want to be a manager. I will be your manager. I will do all the things that you don't wanna do with being an artist, and I'll like, do it. Wow. For free. And I was like, you're hired, like let's do it. So she dmd you and was like, I want to, I want to help you. Yeah. Wow. That's very cool. She reached out one of like the first people who like ever believed in what I was doing. Jackie. Right. Jackie, shout out Jackie. Shout out Jackie. Hell yeah. Um, so, yeah. And that, that's so cool. So what, what were you doing that inspired her to reach out to you? I probably had like. Five or six songs about at this time. And I, I think there was like at one point in 2021 where I had one TikTok get like 10,000 views, like something not even that. Yeah. Crazy. And I think she just like, she was like, I found you from this. And I just, I love every song that Yeah. And I had like six or five songs at that point. Yeah. Um, and, and that's a cool, you know, I think when it comes to the. Artist manager relationship. There's so many different ways that it can look. I think it's cool that like you were both coming up together. It's like she wasn't, everyone wants to get like the huge manager. Everyone wants to work with Mo Easy. Yeah. Like, okay, cool. But to find someone else that's like, Hey, I'm. I'm trying to build my career. You're trying to build yours? Yeah. Let's, let's do it together. It was like, let's work on this together. So like, as she was learning things about being a manager, I was learning things about being an artist. So it just, it just worked really well. So Cool. And she's part of, um, two plus two management, so, which I now just like, just signed for, so now I'm like officially a part of her, the management company she works for. Hell yeah. She was kind of having me as like her side project for like three years since then. Yeah. Yep. Good stuff. Yeah. Um, and so this EP though, you guys dropped this EP and that was a big moment. You said you basically five Xed your following. Yeah. Doing that. What was that with a, a label that was independent. That was, you did that totally independently. Yeah, I did that. So what, what, how was that so successful? Like you just came to, I was just posting every single day. I was doing the red suit, the dance music needed a villain and it just like. People were listening. And then I feel like Spotify started noticing me. I like the first time I got on like a Spotify playlist, I got a cover on the Spotify playlist in like January of 2024. Um, for my house record, the auction sick. So I was like, okay, this is cool.'cause now Spotify knows who, who I am. Yeah. So like, even though I was independently. Promoting this project. I was still getting a couple songs in, like the Bass arcade playlist or like the Chad Mojito playlist. I was like, wow, we don't have a label and we're on these big Spotify playlists. So like, that's a good sign. How are you getting on the Spotify playlist? That's everyone's question is like, it seems like such a crazy castle to breach. I feel like everyone always wants to know how to get on those editorial playlists, and I, I, I feel like I'm not the one to like explicitly tell you like there's only one way Yeah. To do it because I don't. Really know how it happened. I mean, yeah, it's so elusive. I mean, like my manager certainly did an amazing job pitching it to distributors. Like she knew like how to explain my brand and have the music, you know, kind of explain the brand, explain the song. So she obviously did great on pitching everything. Um. Yeah. I mean, there's no real one answer, but I also wanna say like, you know, once you do get on the editorials, it's not like you've made it. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? Like, that's what I thought when I made got my first play. I was like, oh my God, I'm gonna be famous tomorrow. Yeah. Like I made it like, it's great because now Spotify's know you and you'll get like a, some sort of like passive streaming from like editorials. But that doesn't exclusively mean those listeners from that playlist are your fans. You know, a lot of it's passive listening. That's true. So it's a great stepping stone, but I I, it's not the most important thing when it comes to releasing music, so, yeah. Yeah. Good point. I remember you saying on this other podcast that I had listened to from you, and this was I think maybe three years ago or something that you did it probably, uh, and you were, you were saying, you're like, yeah, I. You basically said you were excited to someday get a million streams. He was asking you like, what's, what's one of your goals? You know, I don't wanna get a million streams on, on one of my records. And you've done that now? I did, yeah. How does that feel? I did it twice actually. I did it on, on that house record, and then the, like me, uh, hit a million. Um, yeah, that was, that was really cool. Um, how long did the excitement around that last, um. Like a couple days, honestly. Okay. Well, what really made it cool was, um, I put this on my story one day, the day after. Um, I hit a million streams on that song in my, like last quarter of grad school after I like called it a quits. I wrote down on one of the classes, the professor said, write down where you see yourself in three years. Like, like one year, two year, and three year. What are you gonna be doing? Mm-hmm. And everyone obviously in the class was like, I'm gonna be the therapist by this point. I have my private practice, I'll have this. And I wrote. First a million streams, um, then tour. Then play a festival. Those, I'm gonna do those like year one, year two, year three, and like after the, and I did it all in a different order. Yeah. Like I played my, the festival, I, it was the first thing I did. I played hijinx in December and the Zeds dead tour was the second thing I did. And the million streams was like the last thing I did. So I had it, but it was in a reversal order. But I, I did everything that I wrote in that class that I wanna do in three years. And I did it in like a year and a half as well. You knew, you knew what you wanted. I knew what I wanted even in that class, and I, I knew I was like writing shit that was different than everyone, but that was what I really wanted. So once I, once that song came in, I was like, wow, I actually just did every goal that I set for that point. Yeah. Are you a big goal setter? Do you like. Do vision boards and write goals down, and I'm stuff, I'm really not. And I was even like, the fact that I wrote those goals and then like, I found that piece of paper that I wrote, like cleaning my closet. I was like, oh my God. Like I'm gonna keep this and like, frame it actually. Um, but I, I, once I hit a million, my girlfriend was like, all right, well now you need to. Set some new ones. I was like, you're right, I need to set. Yeah. Fucking new. What's year and then like next three years. So what are the next goals? I'm still trying to figure out what, what those goals are. Honestly. I mean, I would say a headline tour is, headline Tour is the number one goal of mine right now for sure. Which I'm planning for next year. Yeah, early next year. Yeah. Is the plan right now. Yeah. Um, that would be really cool. Okay. Um, but the other two I haven't really thought of yet, so Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting. It's like, because it's, you know, there's. Streams, tours, shows. Mm-hmm. Okay. What else though? Yeah, you were saying, you were saying earlier that you, um, you, you're interested in like film, film music too? Yeah. Once I, I, I say that like once I've accomplished everything I want with dance music, which is probably like. Headlining some festivals and, you know, getting a couple, I, I want to make a hit record, like a billboard charting. I just don't know if that's like really me or like something that you kind of like actively do. But the point is like, once I do everything I want with, uh, dance music, I wanna move to film music.'cause like film is also a big love of mine. Um, like film scoring that was like, well, I took a class. My favorite class ever in college was. Intro to film scoring, and I just showed up every day, like super excited, like gen, genuinely excited for that class. So I really wanna get into that. You see yourself, uh, you said you started making like hip hop beats originally. Mm-hmm. You see yourself doing, like, producing for other artists or? I would love to make hip hop beats for people. It's like hard because like, I feel like rappers, like when you see, when they see like an EDM artist, like send you beats, they're like, oh, EDMI don't want to, you know, mess with that. But, um, I don't know. I, that's definitely something like. Something I wanna do.'cause I make, there's days where I'm just like, okay, I don't wanna make a bass song today. Like I've done it the last five days when I'm like, get some hip hop drums and make some hip hop. So yeah. So if you could produce for any hip hop artist, who would that be? Like top dream artist to work with? Damn. I like don't even have an answer to that one. Gimme like three. Three. That would be cool to work with. Tyler, the creator. Childish Gambino. If we're doing like dead or alive, I would probably do MF Doom, just'cause that's also an icon of mine, just to have him on, on the record. Well, we just found your next goal then. That's it. Wait. Yeah, that's it. Get a get, get a, get a Track with Tyler, the Creator. Yeah, that's probably a, a track with Childish Gambino. Well, actually I'm a sub Childish Gambino and do Jack Harlow because he's from Louisville, Kentucky and that's where I'm from. There we go. That'd be really cool, Jack, if you're watching. Let's make this shit happen. You got your boy right here. That'd be so cool. Yo, put it down. Yeah. I'm gonna write it down. Let's go. We're gonna, we're going to come back. We're gonna clip this podcast in like two years. Yeah. And be like, Hey, this is the moment it was manifested. Hell yeah. On this podcast. Yeah. Let's go. Um, yeah, I'm curious to hear more, you know, coming from. Working in the, kinda like the therapy space, you know? Sure. The counseling space. Um, do you have any practices that you do to keep your mind right in, in this fun, wild, and awesome journey of being an artist? Yeah. Um, I guess for like, when it comes to like that, I would, I would say like writer's block is something I think all artists kind of deal with. Mm-hmm. Where like, you. Dude, it's like when you're a producer, it's like some days you're just like, oh, I'm him. I'm one of the greats. And the other days like, I'm actually so bad. Like I'm so bad.'cause I, you just make three, you make three songs and they're all terrible. Like those days happen all the time. And that's when you get in the writer's box'cause you feel like you can't write anything. Mm-hmm. And for me it helps, uh. Like for me to just like focus on my other hobbies. So like, I love watching film and just like, even like, not even like watching film, but like kind of analyzing it from like a, like a director's point of view and just like the film scoring, like I really love watching film and then like, getting outside as much as you can. I've been running a lot like 20, 25. I've been like at least two to three times a week. I'm trying to run as much as I can. Um, just getting outside and not thinking about. Just the production for like a couple hours. Just like kind of forget, I like to like forget that song that I wrote that day, so when I come back the next day and remember, oh, I did that. Wait, let me change my base. That sounds way better. Yeah, it would just kinda like Spark and remember Yeah. How it should be. Yeah. Walk away from it a little bit. Yeah, absolutely. Do you usually have multiple projects that you're working on at the same time? Yeah, especially right now. Yeah. There's some weeks where there you have so much and others where. There's not, um, like right now finishing up this EP is a, I mean, like, it's like been finished. I'm just like suddenly like tweaking things here and there, but I'm in like big collab mode in 2025. Yeah. Um, so. Yeah, I'm working with a bunch of different artists right now and just like, like all of my releases so far have been collabs, which is something I didn't do at all last year. Maybe like one or two, but all of them collabs, I got a collab with, uh, I, I think I'm allowed to say this, lose the child sick coming up. Um, hopefully I, I probably can't say when, but I do have a collab lucid out, and that's like something that's Yeah. Is really big for me as a artist that like really. Uh, grew up and took notes of their music growing up when I, or when I was like starting Kila Wickett, I was really studying their music was such a big fan. Yeah. So just like be able to have a song with them is something super cool. That's super cool. Um, so yeah. Yeah. So who, uh, back to that, that same question, I guess on the collaboration side as like a, with the brand and your electronic stuff, like who would be like a awesome dream collab that you'd. Love to work with. I mean, Skrillex for sure. Yeah. That's, that's, that's the God, yeah. That's the one who was chosen. It's like, Sonny, if you're watching Next collapse right here, bro. Watching. Yeah. We're we're we're manifesting it. Yeah. We're, we're just planting seeds is the manifest This be the manifestation episode. We're just gonna circle back to it. Yeah. It's just the moment. It's just, the thing about him is that he. Anytime he drops, especially a project, he changes the game. He shakes it up entirely. Yeah. And I just love artists who does that. Um, and obviously Flu was like my first dance music artist, but I was like, you are my favorite ever. So like I have those two as like my holy grail of my favorites ever. So like those are the two that I would want to for sure. Let's go goals. Yes. Put it on the goals list. Yeah, absolutely. That's cool, man. I wanna go back to your, your passion for film. Sure. Who are some. Directors and like what styles of, and when you're like analyzing films and movies. Yeah. What's your, what's your lane? Who are you into? It's funny, when I say analyzing, it's like I love watching movies that I've like seen so many times either that I grew up on or just like watch, because now I like, since I know how the story goes, I'm like looking at it from a different plot. I'm like, wait, that camera angle is sick. Or like, yeah, wait. I like how they cut it like that. So like I love watching it like that, but I'm the biggest Tarantino fan. That's my number one. Favorite director. Like, it's hard for me to even pick a favorite movies'cause all of them are like, so yeah, they change every month for me. Um, he's a big one. Um, Wes Anderson, just cinematography alone. I think he's the best. I mean, like, I honestly took notes from him for my content videos because his whole thing are symmetrical shots. Yeah. Like every shot of his is like the most sym symmetrically beautiful shot. And like, that's why it's always like my content venues are always like symmetrical. You're gonna have my studio, you're gonna have the artwork in the back. I'm always in the middle of the frame like that. That's really important to me. Yeah. Nowhere near the scale of what he's doing, but I just like the idea of like, symmetrical shots. Yeah. Makes sense to me. So I really like that. So like Tarantino, Wes Anderson are really cool. I really like the Safie Brothers. I don't know if you're, they did, uh, uncut Gems that Adam Samuel movie, but they, the movie they did before, that was good time and I fucking love that movie. Yeah. It's like this like Robert Paton's greatest role ever. That good. Check out. Good time. That was good. I didn't, I didn't love Uncut Gems though. I was a little like, I really liked that movie. A lot of people like. If you, if you like the Safie style, which I do, you're into it. But like I, yeah, it's a style. Yeah. It's like they do stuff really well. Yeah. And then like on the film scoring side, there's like the goats that's like Han Zimmer, John Williams. Yeah. And then like, uh, Trent Resner is really cool. Ludwig Gosen is like probably the greatest right now. Oh yeah, he did, uh, Oppenheimer, he did the score for that. I think he just did the sinners. He's done a lot of score. He's like the new, he's the man. He's the new like John Williams. That guy's crazy. And he did the Awaken My Love Child Gambino album. He was one of the head producers on that, so he's awesome. It like the mo it's like the modern, you know, like he's bringing in like electronic stuff. Yeah. You know, it's not just like the classical symphonic Yeah. Cinematic stuff. He cutting. He's insane. Cutting edge. He's so good. Yeah. Very cool. Um, I love though that you have this passion for film and that you're making the connection to like, pulling that inspiration into the brand, you know, and into the marketing.'cause it is like my, my kind of framework for, you know, what it takes to be successful as an artist is first and foremost it is the mindset. Yeah. Having the courage to fucking go for it. Yeah. Having the courage to walk outta that job that you don't love. Yeah. But then you really gotta make good music. Yeah. Right. That's kind of the product. Mm-hmm. Right. Um, but then you gotta have a good brand and you gotta be good at marketing too. Mm-hmm. Right. And so, you know. Seeing how, like you have been able to hit all of those, um, you know, with a character. Mm-hmm. Right. Okay, cool. I've got, I've got a character, I've got a vibe, I've got this, uh, this style mm-hmm. That's gonna pop out, you know, the, the, the villain of dance music. Mm-hmm. Right. That it, it's like, not only do I have the sound, but. You know, like, uh, my, my friend Chris runs a branding agency, marketing agency called The Cult Creatives. Cool. And he always says that the music is the soundtrack to the movie. You know, a lot of producers were just focused on the music. Mm-hmm. What's the movie that you're creating though? Mm. You're creating the movie I, the Key To The Wicked. That's cool. And you've got the character, you've got the style. Mm-hmm. Um, and then the marketing though too, you said like, you know, back to your, your ep like you were just posting every day. Mm-hmm. Like how, like that I think I draw that back to the mindset too of like, Hey, are you. Willing to put yourself out there every day. Yeah. Right. Which a lot of people kind of have a block and resistance around. Most people are just like, they're, they're really scared at the end of the day of putting their, they're scared of like their peers judging them or strangers judging them, but like. If it really doesn't matter, like you just gotta, you just gotta have a thick skin about it, and you have to also know that they don't really get it, you know? Yeah. No one gets it until you like, kind of make it, and then, and then suddenly everyone gets it, you know? Yeah, yeah. Like there's certainly people, sorry, there's certainly people from like either high school or college that definitely when I started this. Didn't, you know, they thought it was stupid or just like, it wasn't, like it wasn't gonna work. And it's just like, yeah, I don't really care. I'm just gonna keep doing it because like, I think it's gonna work. So, yeah. And I think nine times outta 10, we think people care, but really, nine times outta 10, nobody actually fucking cares. They don't, nobody gives a shit about what you're doing. Yeah. Really. Yeah. You know, like very few people actually care. And especially when it comes to putting yourself out there, it's like, you know. People are looking at a hundred pieces of content every day. Yeah. They're not gonna like latch onto that one thing that you put out. And like, nobody's, nobody's, I hate to say it, it's like nobody cares and nobody's paying attention. Yeah. You know? Mm-hmm. Until you really start to yeah know, like put some real shit out that does start to move things. But um, yeah. In the beginning, I dunno, it's. Most people are not paying attention to what we're doing. Yeah. No one, no one really cares, honestly. So just like do it, you know? Yeah. It's like you never know who's watching at the end of the day. Like,'cause when you start out, you're, you're, you're definitely gonna have like those videos, like if you're posting every day, they're like getting made only like 500 views or something. Or like maybe. Couple thousand, you're like, okay, no one really cares. But it's like, do you really know? You really never know who's watching. Like you, you don't know how many label ars are just kind of like looking for that next thing. Yeah. Like they're one of those 500 like viewers. Like you, you really never know. Totally. Totally. And it's, it's funny too because a lot of times people, you know, some people are watching, but people are, aren't saying anything. Mm-hmm. You know, so it's like maybe you're not getting the comments or the love or the validation that you're seeking, but. So many times people are seeing stuff, they're just not saying anything about it. They might think it's really fucking cool mm-hmm. But they might not like it. Yeah. They might not comment on it. Mm-hmm. But like, they still actually think it's cool. Yeah. You never know who you're, you're impacting and who is, um, like I said, who's watching? Right. You know, I actually just, uh, decided to start doing,'cause I was noticing some resistance to posting with myself. Like I'll just get kind of lazy and I'll just post podcast clips. Right. But not make, um, my own content. Yeah. Just like, kind of speak to the camera and so many different types of content I could be making. So I was like, you know what? Fuck it. I'm gonna do like a 30 day challenge with myself. Right. And just like, I'm gonna just post every day for 30 days. Stay accountable. Yeah. Just, just to flex the muscle. Mm-hmm. Just to flex the. The, I don't give a fuck muscle and just get reps in, you know, and maybe I'll figure out some strategies along the way that work, but it's like whatever the inner resistance is that might feel like, uh, yeah, are people gonna judge me or caring too much about like, you know, what it is that I'm putting out. So, it was funny'cause like literally the very first, I just flipped on my camera instead of. Thinking so hard about what I'm gonna post. I've flipped on my camera recorded like a two, like a, you know, took two minutes to just record some shit talking to the camera and then, and then threw it out. And then it was like, yeah, I had like laid back. Luke commented on it like a little bit later. I was just like, it, it kind of blew my mind. I was just like, the, which is someone I, I love and respect and really, you know, really look up to. I was like, wow, that was so cool that like, I. Took 30 seconds to post some shit that like, took me no energy or effort. And, um, yeah, like you said, you never know who's watching. Mm-hmm. You know, I was like, oh, that was, that was kind of like a cool little like universe nudge. Yeah. You just, just put shit out. Just post it, man. Yeah. Just do it. Yeah. Yeah. So what are you most excited about? What are you looking forward to? I am really excited for this, uh, next EP that I've been working on. Um, yeah, just really been working hard on that. And then this basically next month is just like all, it's like festival season. So like every weekend I'm like doing back to back festivals, so I'm super excited for that, just to see all these new cities and have my friends come aboard and, you know. Come and do like, just, just to see me I think will be really great. Um, even this, this Atlanta, this breakaway Atlanta that I'm playing, um, one of my best, my best friend from college, he was like, when I was, when I first started Quila Wicked, he was like making my cover arts and like shooting me. We would always talk about how like, you know, one day I'm gonna do this DJ thing and you're, you're gonna come with me as like my videographer.'cause he always wanted to go into concert photography. So I'm coming to Atlanta where he lives and I'm like, alright, you're gonna be my media for this. Let's go. So he and he is taking it super seriously. And I have my, another kid from school who's gonna be my tour manager for that show, and he is gonna do another one that I'm doing in, in Canada. And he always really wanted to work in the music industry. I was always like, all right, you're gonna, so like all these people who. Kind of believed in me when I first started and also had that love for like, whether it's like media or just music in general or just like creating something. Just being a part of it. I'm just like, all right, you're coming with me now, like we're gonna do this together. So dude, I love that. Bring Bringing the homies with you. Yeah, it's like entourage. Literally it's my entourage. And like the people who like saw the vision from the beginning are now getting to be a. Part of it. That's so sick, man. I think it's so important to enjoy the journey. Yeah. By the way, it's so easy to get caught up and like, okay, what's the, the next level to get to? And like, I gotta grind and hustle. And it's like, wait. I was like, it's happening. It's happening right now. I swear week in and week out. My main anxiety is like, am I still relevant? Like, are people like forgetting about me? Like, all right, I gotta do this, but I'm, it's like last, I'm like, wow, this is. Great. I'm like doing all these festivals like this is gonna be awesome. So it's like I definitely gotta take time to appreciate, you know, yeah. How I feel. And I am very grateful for what's coming. So yeah, it's been good. Mm-hmm. But you notice those thoughts come up though, of the, am i, am I still relevant? Yeah. Like, yeah. Am I doing okay? Are people forgetting about me? Because like, especially it feels like, it feels hard to kind of like stay relevant now. Like I, you always gotta be posting all the time.'cause people's attention spans are. You always are trying to get on that spot on the festival. Like I'm trying to get the, my slot like later in the night now. Yeah. You know, like I'm trying to, so like how do I do that? Yeah. So like trying to like not only be relevant, but be the most relevant person. Yeah. And it can be a lot to process. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and here's the truth. It doesn't end. Yeah. Because you get to that next spot. Yeah. And then there's the next spot above. Okay. How do I headline though? Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. So, you know, that's something I, I really coach on a lot is it's what I call like the inside out game. Mm-hmm. Right? Where most people were playing the outside in game is like, well, once I get to that next spot, then I can. You know, be enough. Mm-hmm. Right. Then I can feel that sense of peace. Right.'cause I, and until then I'm having this anxiety of like, am I relevant? Right? And, and so we're, we're striving and hoping that, well, once I get the next time slot, once I get the, you know, the more money or whatever, then I'll be happier. Like, exactly. There's a feeling that we're chasing. Right. And, and the whole idea of like the inside out game is like, yo, we, we gotta, we gotta feel that now. Mm-hmm. And come from that place like, yo, I'm already, I'm already there. I'm already him. I'm already, you know, that makes me think about like, people like Zed, who is by the way, like probably the most famous person I know we've like, talked a little bit on, on Instagram, but like he's, had he just headline Coachella, like, I mean he headlines every festival. Yeah. Like how many times he's been on the billboard, like top 100. It's just like, what? Like how, what, what more can he do? Like, I don't like what is his mindset through stuff like that? Like it's so insane to think about stuff like that. Yeah. There's a, there's a good clip floating around of Will Smith talking about like the two. Places of like the biggest depression, which is like when you're at rock bottom. Mm-hmm. And you know, you just have, there, you're, you're at that pit of, you know of it, but also when you're at the top,'cause then you have everything. Mm-hmm. And you're like, damn, I'm still. Not actually still empty. Empty. Yeah. I just still don't actually have the thing I've been chasing this whole time. Yeah. And there's like a huge depression that can come from that as well. Mm-hmm. So, you know, back to I think just like the, the inner game man of how do we, how do we enjoy the process? Yeah. You know, where this was coming from. I think it's so cool to see like, you're bringing the homies with you. Mm-hmm. It's like, yeah. Like. It all gets to be fun now at this stage. Yeah. You know, I remember I, I used to work with, um, uh, David GTA's manager. Cool. And, um, I had just signed my first like baby acts, you know, that I was developing as a manager. And she was. Working with David gta, who was the number one or number two, DJ Mag, you know, DJ that year. He's still like number three. Most listened to artist on Spotify. He's, I, I hate, I hate how much hate he gives, by the way. I will just say he's actually one of the most like, authentic artists. He is fucking, like, he just loves making music with cool people. That's his whole thing. And he gets so much hate. But I remember her telling me, she's like, wow, I really wish. She's like, I actually miss being where you are right now. Mm-hmm. On like the come up. Because she's like, the game now is like, how do we, how do we stay? Yeah. How do you stay on top? Yeah. She's like, the game is different. She's like, it's like that, that game of coming up. She's like, that's like, that's the fun. That's the adventure. Mm-hmm. You know? Mm-hmm. I think we get to just get to make sure we really fucking enjoy it. Yeah. This, this is definitely the coming up in the game. It's definitely the fun part right now. For sure. Yeah. And. I was excited, man. Well, you are definitely coming up. I'm so excited to see what this next year holds for you. I'm so excited to see you throw down tonight with Z's dead. It's gonna be fun. Our course project, it's gonna be, it's gonna be a lot of fun. So yeah, man. Thanks so much for coming through to take the time and, and share all this great stuff with everyone, dude. Yeah, thanks for having me. I appreciate it.